Frankfurt Report: The Opel Flextreme Diesel Concept
By Bob Lutz
GM Vice Chairman
As I’ve said before, I’m more excited about the Chevrolet Volt than anything else I’ve seen in my many decades in the auto industry. This week in Frankfurt, we unveiled a European version of the E-Flex line, which we call the Opel Flextreme diesel concept.
Even before anyone discusses the technology, I really think the first impression the Flextreme makes is that it’s a great-looking car. Mark Adams, GM Europe’s Vice President of Design, told the gathered media that the Flextreme shows the future design language for Opel. Its monocab proportions fall in between the popular Astra and Zafira models, but as you can see, its profile is much sleeker. And when it’s time to install a car seat, parents of small children will appreciate the rear-hinged passenger door. In fact, it’s been so popular with focus groups that we are moving ahead with plans to put the FlexDoor system into production.
Like the Volt, the Flextreme is powered by an electric motor, with a small internal combustion engine to recharge the batteries if needed. In the Opel Flextreme, though, that engine is a 1.3-liter CDTI diesel. The car will be able to run about 55 kilometers (almost 35 miles) on one charge. Our research shows that will cover the round trip of 75% of European commuters. Once the diesel engine kicks in, the Flextreme will emit less than 40 grams of CO2 per kilometer driven, far below the proposed European Commission’s target of 130 grams of CO2 per kilometer.
And, as an added bonus, two specially designed Segway Personal Transporters will fit in the Flextreme’s underfloor compartment. This will allow commuters to park outside the city center and ride their Segway Transporters the rest of the way. In Germany, commuters in Bavaria and Nordrheinwestfalen, Saarland and Hamburg — representing more than a third of the German population — are now allowed to ride their Segways on the streets.
So we think the Flextreme concept, along with the Segway Transporters, can significantly advance clean urban mobility. We’d like to hear what you think, especially those of you in Europe.
UPDATE: Check out FYI for video of the Flextreme.
- Posted in Auto Shows, Bob Lutz
Stan
I think it is more practical and realistic the the US Volt concept. I hope we will soon get a new Volt bodystyle that is sporty but utilitarian. The camaro look and smashed roof have got to go.
Gary Dikkers
Mr Lutz,
What I think is that Opel just jumped ahead of Chevy. Why isn’t your Volt design team as innovative as the Opel team?
The Flextreme appears to solve the design flaws that people have pointed out about the Volt — especially the poor visibility. Plus they made provisions for the Segway, have apparently provided enough space to actually carry something, and it will use a clean diesel to charge the battery.
Best,
Gary Dikkers
Paul
They could ride their Segways. Or they could walk.
Other than that, it looks like a really nice car. When’s it coming to the US?
Noel Park
DO IT!
edvard
Bob,
I think the car itself is a terrific concept and utilizes technologies that could very well be a success in Europe. That said, I was in total agreement until you mentioned that two Segway personal transporters would fit in the underfloor compartment.
These things cost well over $5,000 each, or about the same as a nicely equipped motorbike. I live in Palo Alto, CA- the heart of Silicon Valley, and even here, these are a rare site. They are seen as mere playthings for the rich and eccentric. Do not design a car around a product that is not universally accessible. If you’re going with the idea of having the ease of providing storage for other forms of transport, you’d be much better off making way for such common and easily affordable items such as bicycles.
Michael Kessen
I’m really glad to see GM using diesel hybrid technology. It has often baffled me as to why it’s not being implemented more widely. Is it just the extra cost of a diesel engine over a gas unit? Whatever the case, when will expected fuel consumption numbers be available? Also, what are the chances of Saturn getting a version of this?
Greg Royal
An interesting twist on the hybrid theme. Anything that gets around the (fuel) distribution issues and it’s entrenched interests are welcome.
FrankNic
Gary Said: Why isn’t your Volt design team as innovative as the Opel team?
I fail to see how the Opel is so incredibly innovative when compared with the Volt. It’s capable using the same motor, and personally speaking I think the Volt looks 100X better. Big deal the Opel can carry 2 segways, have fun spending 6 grand for something that walks for you. As for me, ill be putting that money towards my Volt and WALKING all the way to the bank.
mike
I really like the Volt and the Flextreme. I think they would be a great alternative in the urban setting.
Just a couple quick points about the upcoming Camaro:
*The concept is awesome with a great look that pays homage to the roots of Camaro.
*The mechanics of the platform with a fully independent front and rear suspension provide an excellent foundation for high performance. This is also a great attraction.
I would like to see GM leverage this great foundation by going one step further with the revival of the high powered Camaro SS or Z28 to put the Shelby GT500 in its’ rightful place, in the rear view mirror.
We performance guys want the opportunity to purchase the new Camaro with an LS7 or other engine combination with 500+ hp.
I’ve got three words for a 500 hp Camaro SS:
Build It…….please
Kindest regards,
Mike
Andoni Aguirre
This car is very innovator, and in my point of view OPEL has applied the good design with this tipe of cars.
I think that this type of technology would be applied on other segments too.
Gereon Langlitz (Germany)
Hi Gary,
I think the concept, both of the Volt and Flextreme is absolutely great and pretty similar, so, in my opinion, it’s just a matter of personal taste, which model to prefer.
Aaron
I think a turbo diesel hybrid would be the way to go. My “1981″ Diesel Chevette got between 45-50 mpg and was dependable. That is 25 year old hardware. Look at the new honda diesel http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/06/07/2009-honda-accord-diesel-to-hit-52-mpg/
GM should be able to meet or beat this…
Edward Hayes
You tell them Bob,
If your new technology does not come with a new “knock-out” design don’t even show up to the party. There is nothing like an old design to take wind out of the latest electric/hybrid concept.
Volvo C30, Ford Escape, Honda Accord Hybrid, this that and the other-they are fooling themselves if they think these vehicles are going to make an impact. Think of drive train technologies as the modern equivalent of the horsepower wars of the 60’s and 70’s. A souped up 400hp engine is nice, but it better be in a Chevy Camaro and not in a Yugo Uscaro.
But with this concept GM has taken a leap and excelled on both fronts.
Let me put it this way-
“That’s one small step for a brand, One giant leap for General Motors.”
The Volt and now the Flextreme are an amazing one-two punch in both design and technology that everyone is seeing and still not believing. They are like me, I believe it and you can and will do it, but I still can’t believe it. How did they do that?
Steve F
Bob,
The Opel Flextreme is really hot looking. This is a great design. I agree with others that I like the Flextreme design more than the Volt. Please provide both designs in the US. Hope we can see a future Saturn Flextreme or something like it. Even if it is not diesel, that if fine, just provide the alternate body style in US.
Charles
But will you build it?
When?
Nothing in this car is really radical, except that you don’t really have the 35 miles’ worth of batteries. You could built it NOW without the plug-in bit and have something that could compete with the Prius… but you’re not doing that. Why not?
Luke
USA availability?
Please quit sending all of the good stuff to Europe, and sell some of it here, too!
Gary Dikkers
Frank,
Style is in the eye of the beholder. If you think the Volt looks better, I won’t argue.
However, the Segway is optional. They are expensive and if you don’t want one, don’t buy one. I wouldn’t want one either. But you have to admit it is being innovative to include a place to carry one.
The hatchback configuration also offers more utility than the squashed sedan configuration of the Volt. It looks like you could actually drive a Flextreme to Home Depot on Saturday morning and bring home a few bags of fertilizer, or take the kids to their soccer game.
It’s a personal choice, but I would prefer the hatchback configuration of the Flextreme.
I’m not too crazy about that thick center pillar in the rear hatch, but I’m guessing that is just a style-point to make a statement with the concept car and won’t be in the final version. (Let’s hope.)
Best,
Gary Dikkers
Sam O
Hey guys, I just looked at the pictures of the Aveo from the show. In my opinion it would have best in class looks if something would be done with the large lower grill. I realize it is part of the new corporate look but it is just too big. Please decrease the size and I think that you could have a winner in this growing class.
Again
Bob:
You get disappointed by the North American Operations results yet every time I read an article about new product it’s Euro based. Is the idea that American’s won’t like the new concepts?
Lyle
Mr. Lutz:
Congratulations on steering GM into the future of our world. Plug-in is the answer to many problems, sociopolitical, economic, geosocial, and security. Not just for the U.S., but for the world.
For some more feedback on the Flextreme, see this link:
http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/10/the-opel-flextreme/
Tracy
All I want is a new Trans Am, don’t care about anything else. Pontiac has not made anything worth looking at since they stopped producing the Trans Ams.
Fred
Bob,
The FlexDoor system looks good in concept. But I have my doubts that it is truly practical.
Here’s a quick test using a similar system already in production. First get an extended cap Silverado. Load it up with four passengers, 2 front and 2 back. Next drive to a near by supermarket parking lot and park between two other vehicles. Now have all four passengers exit the vehicle at the same time. Understand the problem?
What’s practical is rear sliding power doors. Like the ones missing from the Outlook and Acadia. Simply hit the button on your fob and set junior in his car seat. Our 01 Montana may be the biggest piece of automotive junk I have ever purchased. But, I love the power sliding doors.
Gereon Langlitz (Germany)
Dear Mr. Lutz,
congratulations for this beautiful concept-car. My proposal: The Flextreme also should be offered (at least as an option) with an univalent LPG-capable engine. First of all, LPG is about 50% cheaper than Diesel, burning extremely smooth and clean, it’s easy to store inside the vehicle and there’s no particle-filter required. What might be an interesting issue: How would the Flextreme be classified, concerning our annual vehicle-tax? If the Flextreme would be seen as a Diesel, this tax would be significantly higher, than if it would be running on LPG, gasoline or E85. Example: My 2.4 Alero is 200 Euros (per year) lower in taxes, than my colleague’s Mercedes C 220 Diesel. Another question: What’s to do, if a Flextreme-owner had to refill her/his car very rarely and visited the gas-station in summer for the last time? For the cold season, normally there’s required so-called Winter-Diesel…
Thanks for paying attention.
Tim
It’s GAME TIME at GM, and they are really on the ball! I LOVE E-Flex and B100 is KING and this vehicle’s basic design is absolutely stunning, However…
I don’t like the suicide rear doors. They are heavy and hard to seal. (The ones on my GM pickup whistle. At least make them fold back almost to the rear wheels.
I don’t like the split opening of the rear door(s) because they make large loads impossible and I like to use my eyes and not complex, expensive camera systems. Try to put a bike or chain in it with that pillar blocking the way.
I don’t like the headlights coming almost to the ground. This makes them easy to break or chip and hard to keep clean.
I wish the displays were green because red is hard on the eyes and please don’t run the window washer fluid through the wipers as it freezes in the winter.
An most important of all, sell it in the US! Now, if they only had a ragtop E-Flex sports car such as the Miata…
Jack Davidson
Bob, Why aren’t you telling the Europeans that they should be using E85 instead of diesel? You keep touting the corn-o-hol here in the US, despite studies that say more energy is used to produce the stuff (along with inordinate amounts of water) than the energy that you get out of it. What’s worse is the reduced fuel economy with E85 vs. diesel and impacts on other economic segments.
Why the inconsistency in your message?
the law
I know Chevy and Saturn are going to get these 1st.
Does anyone have any idea when Saab will get diesels and or hybrids?
I like the style of Saab 9-3 but would prefer either Die/Hy or combination of power plants.
Life would be great to have styling,mileage,horsepower with XWD.
Ben
Too bad it will never come to the USA.
Why is it that GM STILL has not produced an American passenger car with a CDTI diesel…or with a true hybrid system…or with etc.
Your talk about the Volt, Flextreme, etc. They’re concepts. Until I see them in dealership showrooms, I’m not going to take you seriously when you talk about ‘new technology’.
I mean, you’re the company that is still using pushrods with 4 speed auto transmissions (i.e. - the Pontiac G6 GT) in *2008* models. And you talk about ‘technology’. That’s laughable.
The competition has the technology. Where are GM’s CVT transmissions? Where are GM’s true hybrid vehicles? (those ‘mild’ hybrids that get maybe 1-2 MPG more than the standard engine are not TRUE hybrids in the sense of a Toyota Prius for example).
Why is it that Europe gets all of the nice vehicles, but American gets the dumbed down, ‘rugged’ stuff that nobody wants?
Perfect example (not GM, but Ford) - Europe has the Ford Kuga. America has the Ford Escape. The Kuga is a sleek, ‘edgy’ vehicle that is VERY appealing. The Escape is boring, outdated and ‘meh’ in every sense of the word.
Luckily for GM - you have a competent ‘product czar’ in Bob Lutz. However, GM is not immune to ‘out of touch’ vehicles either - you have vehicles like the Cobalt and the Monte Carlo for example - that are just lame compared to the competition.
This has got to stop if GM truly wants to become a leader again like they were in the past. It’s nice to see vehicles like the 2008 CTS…but you know as well as I do that luxury cars aren’t high volume - Chevy is where the money comes from in America.
I guess what I’m trying to say - is why can’t Chevy be as good as Opel? As good as Holden? Why is Chevy so second-rate compared to European and Japanese cars?
When you resolve that issue,
you will have fixed your product problem.
Lee Youngblood
Mr. Lutz:
I work in the political world. But I also love to talk, look and study everything auto related, and this blog is a great venue for that. Now most of the time, one wouldn’t associate those two worlds very much. But, my question today relates to both.
In my part of the country, Toyota, Nissan and Honda have all placed huge plants around my region. They’re investing here like gangbusters. Together with their suppliers, they’re replacing lost jobs in other industries with automotive jobs, which are better. I know this, because my job has enabled me to work with these companies from time to time.
Of course these “foreign” companies are becoming fully domesticated, and they rightfully have the support and ear of our governor and congressional delegation because they’ve created so many jobs here, invested heavily and so on. They are big consitutents, for sure.
GM and the domestics might be in danger of losing political support/clout in the hottest growing regions of our own country because so many of GM’s competitors have laid down a larger footprint in those areas.
How does GM view this? The domestic auto market is still the world’s largest, and to have an emerging situation like this in the home market has got to be something GM is concerned about.
Please don’t misunderstand, I’ll always have a GM product in my garage (sitting next to my wife’s Toyota) But, as a liftime GM customer/enthusiast who wants to see GM and America prosper together, I’m just asking your thoughts about this issue.
Jim
I love the Volt and the Flextreme and will buy 4 of them when they go on sale in 2010. One for me, one for my wife, and one for each of my kids. I am currently spending over $12,000 a year on gasoline to keep the current 4 cars going. I would rather spend an extra $5,000 to $10,000 on each car when I buy it than spend $12,000 annually on gasoline. I will still be way ahead even taking into consideration electrical useage.
Noel Park
Thank you Aaron for your important and valuable comments, 9/11, 4:51 PM. I agree.
If Honda can make a small diesel meet the US emissions requirements without the dreaded urea injection, so can GM.
While I have sworn to be first in line to buy a gasoline powered Volt, clearly the diesel could put up even better fuel economy numbers, thus gaining priceless braging rights.
I also agree with others 1) forget the Segways, and 2) bring it as a Saturn if that’s what works for you. Although we would much prefer to be driving a car with a bowtie on the grille.
ghent
you should allocate at least 50 million to market the new Cadillac CTS. it’s such a great product that can rival the BMW 3 Series and Mercedes C Class. it’s a chance of a lifetime to redefine Cadillac in US, Europe, China and India, the four largest markets.
Dave G
How fast does the Segway go? Is it a lot faster than walking? If so, how safe are they in traffic? (traffic includes cars, bikes, people, and other Segways)
Anyone have a link to an independant analysis of Segway safety?
FrankNic
Gary,
Thank you for addressing my question. I cannot argue with your opinions, because as you stated, they are a matter of personal choice. I will admit that the segway storage compartments are creative, but in my opinion not very practical. On the innovation front, I think it would be in GMs best interest, to partner with Apple. If the new Nano is any indication of what they can do, im sure they would come up with a next Gen driver interface, that will blow your socks off.
-Frank
Edward Hobart
I recommend the video on gmeurope.tv. The doors are a great answer to accessability. I especially liked the cameras replacing the rear view mirrors. The rear view display in the dash is slick and practical.
The current Volt styling will probably be dated in 2010. Please make it big enough for a 6′6″ fellow. Thanks, Bob.
Noel Park
Following Lyle’s suggestion (9/12, 1:25 PM), I went to gm-volt.com. I could not get it to open.
Across the top is a list of topics. One of them is “Waiting List”, or words to that effect. I could not get it to respond.
Many bloggers, including me, have suggested a waiting list, possibly including deposits a la Smart, or even larger.
Will this website shed light on this idea? Can the blog administrator from here check and see what is up with the website?
Help!
Devin McQuarrie
I have to admit, every time I see a concept vehicle the first thing I think is “Is this design really realistic? Is it feasible to field?”.
No offense Mr. Lutz, but I just don’t see this kind of concept car ever making it to production. There may be some tech-transfer from this concept to other current or upcoming models. Although the European’s may be more avant-garde in their acceptance of innovative designs, this car just looks like another concept that will just “show & stow”, to be put in a warehouse somewhere to sit until someone borrows cues from the design for another model.
Alicia Dorset
If anyone is interested in seeing photos, we have a Flextreme set on Flickr. -Alicia
Gereon Langlitz (Germany)
“Bob, Why aren’t you telling the Europeans that they should be using E85 instead of diesel?” - Jack Davidson
Dear Mr. Davidson,
E85 also increasingly becomes a subject over here in Europe, though much slower than in The States. Sweden is going ahead, but the main difference to the US is the use of biological waste (e.g. from wood) for the production of alcohol. Another option is the growing of switchgrass (or maybe further plants), which don’t require any intensive agricultural efforts at all. For example, Saab and Ford are selling E85-capable cars over here already. I think it’s absolutely stupid, as long as the European Community on the one hand pays millions of Euros to our farmers for shutting down their fields, instead of using those capacities for the responsible growing of biological mass, which could contribute to the production of E85. On the other hand they are criticizing the CO2-emissions…
Alicia Dorset
Hi Noel-
I just looked at the site right now, and didn’t have any problems seeing anything. Perhaps it was down when you went to check it out? -Alicia
Saab 9-3 Owner
My 2006 9-3, open sunroof, a sunny day and GM in my my portfolio…a lovely day indeed!!
Tom Guarriello
While the content of this post is interesting, I continue to be impressed by Mr. Lutz’s facility as a blogger and, more recently, as a video blogger. In many ways blogging is dangerous for senior executives…kind of like giving a child a chemistry set without the dangerous stuff taken out…but Lutz has proven it to be a great tool, in the right hands. Congratulations for continuing to be the standard-setter in this area, Bob.
Edward Hayes
See I told you GM.
The BMW X6 is doing exactly what I said would happen.
They are molding the high seat SUV driving experience into a coupe. That is exactly what I have been telling you to do with Buick and its sedans.
No more low sedans I told you.
Why doesn’t anyone listen to me?
Anyway, you have to listen to the competition now.
I am tired of GM being behind the design curve.
Anyway, good news on the labor front, GM is about to change the world and solve the greatest problems facing the US.
1. Heathcare
2. Energy Independence
3. Competativeness
Lets take the good with the bad.
Noel Park
Alicia:
Thanks for your help. I did get it to work. Sorry to bother you - I thought it was an official GM blog. Very interesting though.
Thanks for the Flickr pictures. Very cool. It only reinforces my previous comment though - forget the Segway(s)!
Gereon:
Nice to see you commenting so frequently lately. I totally agree with you, as always, on the LPG. I just don’t get the resistance to LPG.
The TrueTalk Blog
Bob Lutz: My Blog Put A Human Face On GM
All of you loyal TrueTalk Blog readers out there know that I have a great deal of admiration for Bob Lutz, Vice-Chairman of GM. Lutz started blogging several years ago and for about a year and a half after he
Gary Dikkers
That’s a first-rate idea Frank, in fact it’s so first-rate that VW and Apple are already in collaboration. Hold on to your socks:
Apple/VW iCar
Several months ago we commented on this blog that such a partnership between GM and one of the Silcon Valley companies could be productive, but also problematic. It would be too much of a culture clash — can you imagine some Silicon Valley dude working at the Rennaissance Center looking for the sand volleyball court to play on during lunch break, or showing up for a corporate meeting in a Hawaiian shirt, jammers, and flip-flops carrying a green-tea/pomegranate spritzer in his hand?
Even a VW/Apple marriage would be a culture clash, but I’d guess a better fit than would be GM/Apple.
GM will have to be content with Delco. (sigh)
Cheers,
Gary
Gary Dikkers
Right on Gereon,
It should be LPG-capable — in both Europe and the US.
Unfortunately, that’s not likely to happen until GM’s friends in Congress pass an “LPG loophole” similar to the “E85 loophole” GM takes advantage of to avoid CAFE penalties.
In fact, an “LPG loophole” would even make sense, while the “E85 loophole” is nothing more than that — a loophole.
Best,
Gary
Gary Dikkers
What’s a Flextreme?
Mr Lutz,
I have to ask, “What’s with this name Flextreme?”
Since you chose Volt for the Chevy electric, why not stick with electrical units for the electric cars of your other divisions? May I suggest as possibilities:
All are electrical units named for the early giants of physics who made fundamental discoveries experimenting with electricity — as did Conte Alessandro Volta for whom you have already named the Volt.
But I would steer away from the Opel Ohm since we all know the ohm is a measure of resistance.
Best regards,
Gary Dikkers
Gary Dikkers
Noel,
But I think you’d have to admit that Opel’s lightning bolt logo also has a lot of “pop.”
Cheers,
Gary
Peter Virvilis
There is no doubt that GM is coming out with quite a few great cars but you need to do something about your dealerships. This week I started looking for a new entry level luxury car. I’ve been to GM, Mercedes, BMW, Infiniti and Lexus dealerships and I have to say the GM dealerships are by far the worst of the bunch. Either the dealerships are run down with tacky looking salesmen in $50 suites and/or the Cadillacs are mixed with cheap looking Chevys or Pontiacs and/or the Cadillacs have these big goddy wheels that only a pimp would want. How can Cadillac compete with the other luxury makes in this type of environment. Your products are good and getting better but for you to really compete the dealerships need to be repositioned and improved.
Peter
the law
Volt would be a hit with youth and middle aged man.
while Flex would be a hit with families that have children.
Bring bother over.Chevy& Saturn!
While your at it,if producing more models lowers technology cost.
Add a Buick or Caddy sedan model.
Saab should be getting Bio-Diesel too.
Steve F
Bob and GM,
Hope you read this. Comment on providing rear doors like in the Opel Flextreme (called Flex Doors) in production version of E-Flex vehicles. I really like the looks of Opel Flextreme and would prefer a hatchback design over the sport car design of Chevy Volt. Only would not like the reverse swing of the rear doors. Initially when I saw them I thought it was really cool and would want them, but after thinking about it and the possible impact on design complexity and saftety and ablity for vehicle to hold up with that time of door, my vote it no. Be sure to do full market analysis before providing a door like that in production. Focus on quality and strong, long lasting vehicles. Recommend provide a E-Flex with outside look like the Opel Flextreme but make the rear doors and rear hatch like the standard todays design. Better for the masses.
noel park
With Alicia’s good help, I finally found my way into the gm-volt.com website.
It is really informative. I highly recommend it. Check it out!
Frank Meinert
Gary,
Your hypothetical Silicon Valley dude might have a hard time finding the volleyball court at the RenCen, but he could use the one up here at the Tech Center in Warren. C’mon, we’re not as backwards as you think!
BTW: Opel Watt?? What?? I’ll admit that I’m not too crazy about “Flextreme”, but Opel is heavily invested in the “Flex” theme.
stan
I just don’t understand why Europe gets the best car designs. Even Ford won’t release the Modeo. I think it is smart that have Saturn mirror opel. No need to increase costs by developing different models. Just design these world cars like BMW, Volvo Vw etc.
I really think the Opel e-flex design would be a big win if the final product is a little smaller like the Prius. Onece it comes out why not offer a sports sedan e-flex and then a small utilitarian version of those cute Mini cars you had us vote on.
Please don’t give USA the retro HHR version of the mini’s. Make it moder to compete with Smart, UP, and toyotas new Micro car concept. Retro is out! Modern is in!
JohnP
I think you have a winner. Bring it here and we will buy. But first you have to talk to some of the states, such as PA, where it is illegal to ride(drive?) a Segway on teh street, sidewalk, or even bikeway - since it is powered. My state hates electric scooters as well (unless you make them DOT-legal).
Steve F
How about calling it Opel Jolt. Little different than the Volt but still got a punch.
André
Will the Flexdoor ressurect the hardtop sedan with four frameless doors, no B pillar and a lot of style and elegance?
Gary Dikkers
Frank,
Not backward, I’m just saying there would be a culture clash between GM HQ and Apple. I imagine one as being very conservative with a “We can’t do that. Why, we’ve never done it that way before.” with mid-level managers and executives needing to signoff on every decision, and where showing up in the correct three-piece suit is more important than a person’s ideas. While I imagine the other as being, “Why not? Let’s give it a try.” while giving the junior designers and engineers as much free rein as they need to be at the cutting edge of technology and style.
Of course I may not be right, but that’s my perception — and I suspect others share that perception.
However, I have a sneaking hunch the culture clash between the Warren Tech Center and Apple would be a lot smaller than the gap between the RenCen and Apple.
Best regards,
Gary Dikkers
Michael
I guess I must be the total cynic when it comes to these things. First, I think it’s a lovely concept. For once, I think a GM designer came up with some that looks attractive. But I heave a major sigh because, well, let’s face it, this ain’t never gonna see production, gang. It’s vaporware, pure and simple.
Have we all forgotten there’s not battery in existence to make this car a reality? It’s a nice concept, but like the Toyota iQ, it’s just a concept. We’ll never see it on our streets, in the parking lot at the local shopping mall (or in my case, parked on the street with the parking meter ticking down the seconds until the meter maid comes to give it a ticket while the owner looks frantically for an outlet to plug it in). A heavy dose of reality would go so far.
And even IF the batteries exited, clearly GM has no intention of bringing in this car to American shores because it would prove what a fraud the rest of the lineup is. Mega sigh…
Tim
Mr. Lutz, I believe that you are doing an excellent job! I can’t wait to own a volt.
I do wish that you would go one step further and stress renewable electricity including home rooftop PV electricity. Focusing on the electric only range is confusing. Nobody wants a car with a “40 mile range”. Perhaps you can memorize a little 5 second sound bite on the mpg between charges.
Example “According to statistics, 82% of all commuters travel less than 40 miles each day. During these commutes, the Volt uses no gas at all. When driving 100 miles, the Volt will get around x mpg, 150 miles equals about x mpg, 250 miles = about x mpg and when going the full 650 mile range on those really long trips, the Volt will get over 54 mpg”
There has to be a way for you to memorize and then repeat this statement at every opportunity. It should be in every advertisement.
Electric Range, MPG at different ranges, lower maintenance costs, longer vehicle life, greater drivability, lower emissions and a much lower cost of ownership during the X year expected lifetime.
Noel Park
Stan, 9/14, 2:23 PM:
I could not agree more with every point raised in your comment. Well done and thank you very much!
Believe it or not bloggers, but my mother tried to raise me to follow the maxim, “If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all”.
Thus, the record will show, that I stifled myself and submitted no comments on the recent post discussing the HHR SS, or whatever it is.
Now that Stan has broken the ice, however, I am compelled to agree with him. HHR? You’ve got to be kidding!
Nate
That looks pretty neat. I just saw that GM is making a 4.5L version of the Duramax. I hope they have the good sense to put that engine in the G8 and other cars with that platform. Heck even the CTS and a new rear wheel drive Buick would be awesome with that kind of engine… 300 HP and 500 Ftlbs… and good fuel economy… GM would be pretty foolish to not do that. Pair it up with a decent transmission (6 speed auto and 6 speed manual) and GM has a decent performing high economy car. Now to see if it actually happens.
James N.
For those of you who haven’t done the research.
The E-flex in the Chevy Volt can be configured to run on gasoline, E85, and biodiesel.
And for the people above who are wondering where GM’s hybrid systems aren’t in passanger cars. GM made the decision to put them where they would do the most good. I.E. public transportation.
http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/archives/2007/05/why_500_hybrid.html#comments
Edward Hayes
BMW and the X6 state the case that the crossover is crossing over to the sedan segment.
Let me tell GM exactly what I told them long ago (and you can check the record, ie. the blog) that the sedan is next in line for an SUV style high seat, high roof, command seating, a la the SUV.
And BMW which is always 5 years ahead of the design curve is the first to do it with the X6. The first crossover with a coupe style hatch and four doors.
What’s next? A similar conceived crossover with a standard trunk.
All of this does not surprise me, it was only a matter of who would be first.
I know development takes time and I know the market for the X6 is not proved and I know it is just a concept at this point but from the looks of things, just prepare to be dazzled once again by BMW who brought us the X3 and other ground breaking segments in the SUV arena.
I know GM is making world class progress in design and technology with the Volt and Camaro and either one of these will shake the automotive world but there is that saying…
No matter how good you are, there is always room for improvement.
In this case it has a high roof, SUV style seating, four doors and a coupe style hatch in the back.
Noel Park
Note a story today from AP, posted on Yahoo. I can’t quote the headline verbatim, but the essence is: “Hybrid sales up 49% in the US”.
They report that this was led by a “boom” in hybrid sales in the Midwest, up over 50%!
So much for latte drinking, chardonnay sipping, tree hugging left coast liberals!
Nate
That looks pretty neat. I just saw that GM is making a 4.5L version of the Duramax. I hope they have the good sense to put that engine in the G8 and other cars with that platform. Heck even the CTS and a new rear wheel drive Buick would be awesome with that kind of engine… 300 HP and 500 Ftlbs… and good fuel economy… GM would be pretty foolish to not do that. Pair it up with a decent transmission (6 speed auto and 6 speed manual) and GM has a decent performing high economy car. Now to see if it actually happens.
Rick Lupori
Good to see GM show the Diesel version of the E-Flex which should do well in Europe, this rounds out the options well with E-85 for the U.S. and Diesel for Europe with the potential of a Fuel Cell shown for Asia (if they go that way).
I like your new ad campaign showing how GM is offering a wide range of vehicles from gasoline efficient to gasoline free. It is about time, I have been saying for over a year that GM is the ONLY major automaker that is doing something in ALL areas to improve fuel efficiency.
Although you really need to fill the high MPG car market in the U.S. (this is made more frustrating by the fact GM already makes these cars and has made them for years).
Getting back the the Flextreme, I have seen where the Volt maybe in showrooms in late 2009 (if all continues to progress as I guess it has been) with a “second” vehicle to follow shortly therafter. Will the U.S. get something along the lines of the Flextreme? I also heard that the Plug-in VUE will be available sooner than originally expected.
Congratulations and I can’t wait to hear what all the doubters will say when the Volt makes it to market.
CM
Personally, I prefer the style of the Flextreme to the Volt, but there is a market for both.
I don’t like the rear hinged doors. Like Fred, I think sliding doors (like on a minivan, only smaller) would be better. Or even regular hinged doors - B pillars aren’t that bad!
The rear center post won’t do, and certainly won’t be in the final design, although the twin rear hatch butterfly doors were kinda neat.
The Segways are too expensive to be a standard feature. Optional, well, maybe.
Luke
@Nate,
You can’t seriously think a 4.5L engine will provide good economy?
I drive a Jetta TDI with an automatic transmission, which gets about 40MPG driving comfortably in excess of the legally posted speed limit. My girlfriend’s Prius gets 45MPG-50MPG under the same conditions.
A car that only gets 35MPG seems pretty average, once you’ve driven these cars. Any passenger vehicle in the 20s looks like just an expensive nuisance.
Now that you have some perspective on what “good mileage” means, I can say that I’d *love* to drive a vehicle with 300HP and 500 FT-LBS of torque that gets (just guessing) 25MPG (which would be great efficiency, from a physics perspective). That would be a wild ride, and could probably tow a heck of a big boat. But, don’t confuse a 25MPG sport-sedan/wagon with an efficient (from a social perspective) commuter and highway cruiser like the Jetta TDI or a happy-on-the-highway city-car like the Toyota Prius.
Gary Dikkers
EPA emission standards for a Volt or Flextreme with a diesel-powered generator set
A question for GM to consider — if they haven’t already:
Would a Volt or Flextreme with a diesel-powered generator set have to meet the same EPA Tier 2 Bin 5 emission standards a diesel-powered car would have to meet?
The reason I ask is because there is a big difference: In a diesel-powered car the diesel motor is physically connected directly to the drive train and rear wheels; while a in a diesel-poweed electric, the diesel motor would only charge the battery, and is otherwise not physically part of the drive train.
If a Volt or Flextreme with a diesel-powered generator set didn’t have to meet the EPA Tier 2 Bin 5 standards, that would give GM a lot more flexibility to use an efficient turbo-charged diesel in the North American versions of their electric cars.
Best,
Gary Dikkers
JOSE RAMON ELIAS AVILA
MR. BOB LUTZ
MI SUGERENCIA ES QUE USTED PROMUEVA EL USO DE SUPERCARGADORES ELECTRICOS PARA EL USO EN TODOS LOS MOTORES GM, ESTO PARA AUMENTAR SU RENDIMIENTO Y KILOMETRAJE ASI COMO AMISTAD CON EL MEDIO AMBIENTE. QUISIERA POSEER UN CHEVY.
RECIBA CORDIAL SALUDO
JOSE RAMON ELIAS AVILA
Noel Park
Gary:
If Honda is going to meet the EPA requirements with a diesel next year, it would seem pretty doable to do it with the size of an engine equivalent to the 1000cc turbocharged gas engine proposed for the Volt.
The last rumor I saw was that the diesel was going to be the replacement for the failed Accord Hybrid. If Honda can power a car the size of an Accord, which supposedly meets the standards with a stand alone diesel (no e-flex, or equivalent), what’s the problem with a plug-in hybrid?
Let’s not give these guys too much slack.
Maybe GM should do what we always accused the Japanese of doing in the past. Buy a Honda diesel and reverse engineer it.
Noel Park
By the way, I couldn’t help but notice the series of Chevrolet ads in the LA Times yesterday for the Volt, fuel cell Eqinox, and the hybrid Tahoe. Nice looking ads.
Is the intent that we should be so impressed with Chevy’s good intentions that we run out and buy a current offering, or that we should wait for the plug-in hybrid or the fuel cell car? My decision is the latter.
Luke
Clarification:
On my response to Nate’s comments, I said that I’d love to drive a 300HP car. That doesn’t mean I’d want to own one, on account of the ongoing fuel-cost. I’ll own my efficient commuter / highway cruiser, and rent one of those if I want a wild ride for a weekend.
Bryan
There will always be criticism about the advancements that people/corporations make but the truth of the matter is right now at this very moment Bob Lutz should be applauded because GMC is currently leading the pack in terms of creating greener cars. The problem is taking fossil fuel out of the equation 100% and they have come the closest so far. It is a great design and is environmentally friendly. Cheers!
Rick Lupori
Luke: The 4.5L Diesel will delivler more like 32 MPG in a G8, the 6.0L Gas engine should be rated close to 25 MPG if not 26 MPG.
The 25 MPG figure is for GMT900 model Trucks and SUV’s.
That represents a 20-25% improvement in MPG with little to no sacrifice in performance. That is impressive and if the 4.5L proves popular GM could offer a smaller 3.8L version with 250 HP.
I would like to see GM’s new 2.9L Turbo Diesel in something stateside - the new Malibu? At least the 9-3.
Noel Park
Bryan:
I hear you, but I will really believe it when one is sitting in my garage with the cord plugged in.
I’ve offered several times to put down a deposit a la Smart. How about it Bob?
Rick:
How about a 2.9L turbo diesel in a Colorado pickup? I’m first in line for that. I bet it would tow my single car trailer.
Ames Tiedeman
GM should have been brining Opels to the US 25 years ago. They just never figured any of this out. Japan could have been defeated in the 1980’s had they moved the cars of GM Europe to America.
I can say the same even louder to FORD.
Paul
What in the name of god would I do with a 300 horsepower car that I can’t do with a 120 horsepower car that gets twice the mpg?
My scooter has 9 horsepower, which is more than enough to get me to and from work on a daily basis and still get 70-80 mpg.
I can understand why people who race or who tow trailers might want a huge engine. But I could never use 300 horsepower. I’d rather trade a few seconds 0-60 for a healthy improvement in fuel economy.
E.L.
Paul,
Not everyone’s life is so spartan. Many of us have families–with children (maybe most of us) and live outside of the cities (no place to raise children).
———————-
Mr.Lutz,
I have got to bug you again about Cadillac–my favorite marque.
1. Why is there no model-for model direct answer to BMW’s 3 and 5 Series (X3 an X5 included)?
Can you imagine a Cadillac full of models as good as or better than the 2008 CTS? At the top of their respective classes?
2. Are you all waiting for Lexus to invent the Bose Suspension before you all use it?
It should have been in its third iteration by now, in a leaner, meaner configuration and coupled with Magneride technology.
It should have been looking to go into the upcoming 3-Series competitor and all the SUVs.
Gm needs to wow people again. This would do it hands down.
Cadillac needs this.
3. Why do you hate the SRX?
The car was a hit with th e press. Make it look less “wagonny” and make it a stunner inside and out and underneath like he 2008 CTS.
It will sell!
That was the only thing wrong with it and everybody knew that!
It is too good to put on Lambda (no way Sir!). Put it on Sigma 2!
Love and respect,
E.L.
Tobias
I think this is a great idea. i especially like that it comes with a diesel engine. this is exactly the kind of car that I would want to buy: plug-in hybrid with a diesel engine.
please bring to US as well!!
Suman M Subramanian
Dear Mr. Lutz,
I’ll echo those US residents who prefer the Flextreme’s styling and diesel generator (which’ll hopefully handle B100) over the Volt’s styling and E85 generator. I also like the suicide, er, FlexDoors, though I hope the production rear cargo door will be more of a clam-shell (i.e. without the view-blocking center pillar).
Please offer the Flextreme in the US, but without the Segways; either keep that compartment as concealed storage or just make the luggage space bigger. Thank you.
Sincerely,
Suman M. Subramanian
Tempe, AZ